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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gellor View Post
    There is nothing stopping you swapping Valerie's Tower Shield for a Heavy Shield, lose 2 AC but gain +2 to hit, no point swapping to a Longsword, what do you gain? Nothing, apart from losing some damage going from 1d10 to 1d8, no mechanical difference to hit.
    With longsword Valerie doesn't need exotic weapon feat which can be then used for other feats.

  2. #22
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    I would agree that Amiri is unlikely to change - as an Iconic she's keeping the bastard sword that defines her. Besides, dump the sword, grab a greataxe, done. You are only wasting 1 feat, Amiri's actually one of the better built NPCs. For me the underlying problem is a set of what appear to be contradictory design choices.

    On the one hand we have systems that appear to be encouraging optimised parties - the difficulty, encumbrance, camping needing a full party to be done well etc. On the other hand a number of the companions do not support optimised play through their initial design. Therefore, they are either ignored, or the player is punished for using them. Neither feels like a good outcome and this is what needs to be addressed.

  3. #23
    Senior Member Pathfinder's Avatar
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    I can see good points for one thing: ALL companions should be different when compared to each other. That mean allso weapon/armour of they choice. So I do hope Valerie get some other weapon then Amiri.

    Reason for this is:
    1) If you make a new PC it is only pure logic to think that (based on your companions) what weapons they are using, there WILL be samekind of weapons with magical abilities more then some other versions have.
    2) If multiple companion have same weapon of choice (maybe it be bastard sword or short crossbow) and your PC is using same weapon it most likely lead for situation where PC take "best" weapon and might even lead for situation where some companion is left out because (s)he have no weapon proficiency for all these other magical weapons (let's say estoc +x) party have in stock.
    3) I am not saying that "less usefull" weapons should be used primary (like Octavia should not have weapon proficiency for darts only just because others do not have it) but there are still plenty of good melee weapon choices which make d8 to d10 damage.

    Edit: allso if companion is more of support role it might be good idea to give not only ranged weapon but allso maybe some lesser melee weapon (d4 or d6 damage). Most likely not spend points for it but most archers and so on had some small armour and sidearm with them incase enemy get close. I bet most adventurers who still live have learned that most of the times enemies get close so some melee protection and weapon can be usefull.

    I would personally if possible make somekind of AI for most companions / enemies let's take Amiri for example: she first throw an axe or spear, then charge for melee while draw her bastard sword while Valerie maybe throw her javelin and take her mace or long sword and start getting closer for enemy [shield ready, not charging)
    Last edited by Pathfinder; 04-17-2018 at 06:15 AM.
    "Road to the man's heart go through the chest"

  4. #24
    Senior Member Naliamegod's Avatar
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    The only issue with Amiri is her strength is tad too low. Two-handed martial characters pretty much need 18 strength and from when I checked last time, Amiri has 18 strength on tabletop. I don't know why they changed her stats as she was perfectly balanced in Alpha when she had 18 strength: she was a murder-bot that was balanced by being fairly squishy if you aren't careful. If I would remove chance feat, it would actually be toughness for Power Attack since that actually matches her tabletop character. Barbarians power comes mostly from raging and the rage powers, so a flavorful feat or two isn't an issue for her. I'm more worried that (a.) there won't be any other oversized BS for her and/or (b.) they won't have Vital Strike feats because those are kinda the main selling point of oversized weapons.

    Valerie is the big problem though. Anything above 16 con is overkill for Fighters, and her strength is not only too low to do damage but it means she can't actually do what the game makers intended for her to be: A fully-armored knight as wearing full-plate + towershield will put her well into medium encumbrance, and that is before we give her weapons and other items to weigh her down even further. She isn't really a tank either because tanks in Pathfinder are built around reach weapons and blocking spaces, not being hard to hit (S&B builds tend to be built around offensive builds, not defensive). I don't know why they just lower her CON or put her bonus into Strength or (what I would do) just switch STR-CON. At this point, she can't actually do much in combat except stand around and tank hits, which is perfectly fine against trash mobs like Kobolds but makes her useless in tougher battles, since they they will just swarm her since she can't kill them reliably and lose the action-economy war. She is what they call the sports world a classic "tweener:" a party member that is stuck without a real role in the party because she can't actually effectively do anything.

    What worries me most about Valerie is that she might actually get worst as the game gets more complete. It sounds like they intend for her to be a Tower-Shield Specialist, which means she loses Bravery, Advanced AT and Weapon training, which were the saving graces for the Fighter class, for some "meh" abilities that she might not even be able to really use. It doesn't even really mesh well with the Stalwart Defender Prestige class, since that class is really meant to be played with polearm users and not a S&B build.

  5. #25
    If they implemented Respec it may limit playing through multiple times but it also is liberating since not every character decision is final.

    I'd love to see Respec in the game from scratch - for a fixed cost or even free.

    Would def like to retrain my party members from level 1 on as I chose different classes for many of them due to need.

  6. #26
    Senior Member No One of Consequence's Avatar
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    It they implemented respec, I think it might make more sense to do it between chapters, as characters would have a lot of time to retrain and evolve since a few months/years pass at those intervals.
    In my opinion, it would make more sense storywise.

  7. #27
    There are retraining rules in the PnP version of the game. They are found in Ultimate Campaign, which also includes the updated kingdom building rules.

    Basically there is a bunch of stuff you can retrain for, but it takes time, money, people(trainer) and location to do so.
    On average its about 7 days, per level, to retrain into another class (5 days if the new class is related to your original class)

    So a lv 7 fighter that wants to swap one level of fighter to wizard, would take 7 days to retrain it.

    You need to spend gold and it gets more expensive the higher your character level is.

    You also need someone that is higher level then you in that class to teach you and you need a location. Basically you can't be retraining on the road.

    PK could have the retraining system in the game, but it would require time to code it all in.
    If Owlcat is already tight with the timeline due to the game due to be coming out soon, this may not be a "must have" for the release, but it would great for a future update.

  8. #28
    Senior Member No One of Consequence's Avatar
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    It certainly is not a must have for me.
    I knew about the retraining rules, and I found them interesting when I read them last year, while discovering PnP Pathfinder. While I think it would be nice to have them as close as possible to the PnP version, as everything else, I would understand if a simple, MMO-style rescpec option was offered.

    All in all, it would just be a bonus feature anyway in my opinion.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Emerald Viper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MisterSlanky View Post
    I would highly doubt a respec for story reasons. The characters are the way they are as their backstories are written to them (although there are errors such as Reg's weapon focus which he doesn't qualify for).

    Amiri's bastard sword is an integral (and very important) part of her backstory and she will be used as near perfect example as to why respec won't happen.

    I get more frustrated that they keep doubling up on things. Valerie doesn't need a Bastard Sword, Amiri has one. Trisian has a scimitar as it makes sense, Reg just has one.

    FYI - Bastard sword <> Long sword (1d10 vs. 1d8).
    What IS Reg's Weapon focus in??? I really don't like that yo can not see weapon, skill, spell focuses... Bloodlines.... on Character screens!

  10. #30
    Senior Member Emerald Viper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MisterSlanky View Post
    I am trying to remember the last game of this style (isometric based of licensed property) that allowed a respec and I'm drawing a blank.
    Me too....
    But I think like a character creator or the like or maybe a combat arena to help plan your character. Especially for those of us barely familiar with Pathfinder system.

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