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  1. #21
    Senior Member Mat's Avatar
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    And the worst part about a game like DA: Inquisition is that all of that fluff filler content detracts from the main storyline. I like the game but it pales in comparison to DA: Origins because of all the MMO-style grindy content they've added just for the sake of extra hours of gameplay.

    Wish they'd let us play as the Hero of Ferelden again. Unlike Shepard, I feel like DA1's protagonist story hasn't yet been fully told. Although that admittedly may differ for some people depending on how they played through it.

    Have you played Shadowrun Dragonfall BK? It's one of the better crpgs released in recent years, imo.

  2. #22
    Community Manager Berserkerkitten's Avatar
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    I was so disappointed when they mentioned the hero of Ferelden here and there, but then you never even get to see them! :( It was nice to see Hawke again, but DA2 was a bit... ahem. And yeah, I had zero desire to even explore most of these vast landscapes in Inquisition, simply because they were just full of boring collectables and generic filler quests. The main story was great, though. Sera is the best! :D

    I've played Shadowrun Returns. I had the finger on the buy button for Dragonfall a dozen times during the summer sale, but ended up deciding against it, because the new Path of Exile expansion will go live really soon now and... oh boy, my productivity is gonna drop by a LOT!
    Ye cannae touch this! - Clan McHammer

  3. #23
    Senior Member Stratagemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berserkerkitten View Post
    I've played Shadowrun Returns. I had the finger on the buy button for Dragonfall a dozen times during the summer sale, but ended up deciding against it, because the new Path of Exile expansion will go live really soon now and... oh boy, my productivity is gonna drop by a LOT!
    Dragonfall is good, but honestly? I like Hong Kong better. Harebrained Schemes improved a lot with each new iteration on that series. I'm looking forward to their Battletech Game, but I really want a new Shadowrun game from them soon as well.

  4. #24
    Senior Member Mat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stratagemini View Post
    Dragonfall is good, but honestly? I like Hong Kong better. Harebrained Schemes improved a lot with each new iteration on that series. I'm looking forward to their Battletech Game, but I really want a new Shadowrun game from them soon as well.
    I like the story in Dragonfall better, but it's subjective. Both games are quite good. Really looking forward to Battletech as well. Right now Harebrained is the only developer that automatically gets Kickstarter support from me. They always deliver on their promises.

  5. #25
    Senior Member HenriHakl's Avatar
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    I played all three of the Shadowrun games by Harebrained; and I think the story has been on par with each other in all three cases. I'm from South Africa, but my heritage is German - so I loved the version of Germany from Dragonfall. And I love the monk and eastern stuff (and anime), so Hongkong was great for me as well. Basically I've just had positives from the games. (And it helps that the character mechanics got expanded with each game; even if just a little.)

  6. #26
    Senior Member praguepride's Avatar
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    Dragonfall I think had a tighter storyline overall but Hong Kong is the superior product, in my opinion. All three are solid but they REALLY hit their stride in Dragonfall and you can really tell they listened to feedback for Hong Kong.

    Bioware games tend to fall flat because of the ENORMOUS amount of filler. It's something that Black Isle did really well was to make side quests feel like they mattered. It was the little things like doing favors for people early on and being able to call on them later on that mattered. For ME series there were like 3 tiers of quests: Storyline, Important side quests, and bullshit filler and there was a LOOOTT of that. I low how in the middle of saving the world you have to negotiate purchase orders or find people's missing wallets and other BS citadel quests.

    Some of the BG/Fallout quests were kind of filler but at least they usually had cool rewards afterwards like unique magical equipment or what not.
    I know! Start swinging! Eventually you'll lop off the head of someone important and then the good fights will REALLY start!
    -- Lilarcor

  7. #27
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    Hard to say, as I'm not really a huge <video> gamer, but something very pervasive I see in culture and media as a whole I think is ruining games is this sort of twisted, mainly American feminism, or rather the need to pander to it. This idea that a female character can not be cool, interesting, unique, or powerful unless there are males there to keep her down, which she then is so awesome for overcoming. This is not a good character, nor is it in anyway beneficial to men or women. It's juvenile and formulaic. Let me say this bluntly and clearly, I am not saying to not include badass females. Repeat, I am not saying do not include badass females. Heroes and Horrors, good girls and bad girls. Just don't make their one defining character trait "men told me I couldn't do it, hey look at me, I'm such a "rebel".

    Or, this idea that a woman has to do so much extra to prove herself. It's really dumb and really, really, really overdone. The reality is 95% of men don't care and it's all in that woman's head, as she is cutting her own legs out from beneath her.

    Speaking just for my wife here, but she absolutely hates when things pander to woman by making sure that there is at least a female on the team or creating a female version of something, (Supergirl, Spidergirl, Batwoman, Lady Thor, etc).Seriously, what is the message here? That Females do it better? That a good females is really a man at heart, with boobs? That ripping off stuff is the ideal way to leave your mark?

    Just make women that are interesting on their own merit, not on everyone's else's. Being born with a penis or a vagina shouldn't really have any factor in it.

  8. #28
    Senior Member praguepride's Avatar
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    I'm not too worried about feminism swinging one way or the other. I get your point but Paizo has done a really good job with that kind of stuff and you know they're going to be taking a very close look at Amiri's writing. Their feedback should help keep the game balanced to where it should be.

    Pillars did a solid job too but overall I didn't feel that attached to anyone. Their backstories didn't tease out quite the same way as BG and while they were original I didn't feel like too many of the characters really stood out. Everyone's personalities were kind of dialed down so they weren't bad just weren't exciting. Everyone was kinda "ho hum, I'm perfectly normal"

    edit: You know what? I take that back. The companions in Pillars of Eternity were straight up F-ing BORING!!!

    Eder: Ho hum, I'm just a guy who worshipped the wrong god.
    Eloth: Eloth had potential with the split personality thing but you can tell it wasn't given ANY depth because once you leave Chapter 2 it's 90% his timid, boring Khallid personality.
    Durance: Durance tries to be 'edgy' by calling everyone a whore but you can tell it's dialed down. Just throwing in a a couple of naughty words and innuendo does not a Korgan make.
    Sagani: Oh I'm on a journey that has taken me away from my family for years. Ho hum.
    Grieving Mother: Oh my mind is shattered. Ho hum.
    Pallegina: Oh I have bird feathers for hair. Ho hum.

    It just goes on and on like that. Now many of them do have their special moments and the writing does kick it up a bit during their personal quests but otherwise everything they see is just regular old reactions. There isn't bitter in-fighting in the group that will make managing them a mini-game in and of itself like in BG1 and BG2. Compare the POE companions to Minsc or Jan Jansen or Edward? Hell compare them to Myron or Marcus. Heck i was more attached to Vic then I really am to any of the PoE characters.

    Tyranny at least did this much better and big tip of the hat to Shadowrun Dragonfall/Hong Kong for making the companions really feel like personalities. I'm not saying everyone has to be 110% I'M WACKY!! but have some fun, have some drama with them.

    It feels like PoE are like the worst stereotypes of roleplayers.

    "Oh hello strange druid in the wilderness, would you like to accompany me FOREVER?"
    "Oh hello strange mechanical golem, would you like to accompany me FOREVER?"

    In BG2 (the gold standard) Companions would get upset at your actions. They would leave the party or turn hostile. Several came with time sensitive missions that they would remind you of CONSTANTLY! They would drive each other insane (or develop romances or friendships or SOMETHING).

    Yes you have banter in PoE but it's almost predictable.
    Companion 1: Hey what's the story with blah?
    Companion 2: Short story
    Companion 1: Oh that's interesting.

    Or

    Companion 1: Humorous observation about companion 2:
    Companion 2: Threat
    Companion 1: I'm staying away now

    The writing isn't bad but it is all white bread bland. Actually that's what I have to say about PoE as a whole. Even the dragon fights are kinda ho-hum. They have this immensely detailed setting that I just...don't...care about :(
    Last edited by praguepride; 07-23-2017 at 10:06 PM.
    I know! Start swinging! Eventually you'll lop off the head of someone important and then the good fights will REALLY start!
    -- Lilarcor

  9. #29
    Senior Member Stratagemini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beckett View Post
    Stuff
    Not gonna argue with your views an opinions on this, because this isn't the topic to get into the nuances of feminism, and the Internet isn't the place for it either, but given those views, I will warn you not to use Amiri. You're gonna have a bad time.

  10. #30
    Senior Member Mat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by praguepride View Post
    edit: You know what? I take that back. The companions in Pillars of Eternity were straight up F-ing BORING!!!
    Overall I agree. I think there's a reason they only decided to bring back three of them for Deadfire. Aside from Eder I can't think of a single one of them I genuinely liked.

    All of my favorite party-based crpgs are the ones will compelling companions. Planescape Torment, the ME trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, and the BG series all had a great cast of companions. I think Kingmaker looks like it's heading in the right direction. Jubilost, Octavia, Amiri, and Nok-Nok all look interesting to me.

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